Saturday, June 6, 2020

Trillions

There is a Showtime channel series called "Billions", starring Damian Lewis and Paul Giamatti, but apparently the show only deals with chump change. As we know, the latest stimulus packages from Congress and the U.S. central bank are now each sized in the trillions of dollars. Given that as the case, here is the longer term chart of the cash S&P 500 Index. We know the NASDAQ 100 and NDX have 'gone over the top'. We know the S&P500 has gone up past 78.6%, and may - even eventually - be on the way to 90% or more.

S&P500 Cash Index - Monthly - Degree Labels

We don't know for a 'fact' the S&P500 cash index will get to 90% or 'over the top', but it certainly can. So, why is this analyst is so 'flexible, calm & patient", and not so adamant as a certain very large Elliott Wave service is that a large market turn downwards is immediately underway? After all, who wants to be incorrect, right?

I maintain that the five-wave, non-overlapping, impulse count to the high in October, 2018 is, and was, completely and entirely correct. That conclusion is based on applying correctly sized degree labels to the chart above. These degrees have not changed since the inception of the chart. The degrees are shown as Primary, Intermediate and Minor from bottom left, and progressing up the chart to the SuperCycle. I will not engage in the practice of back-labeling long-standing waves as many Elliott analysts do at every turn.

What I am doing today is providing you with the labels at the top of 2018. It is my contention that the SuperCycle ended at that location. Since that time, we have had three Minor waves down to Intermediate (A) in December 2018, three Minor Waves up to Intermediate (B) in February 2020, and five Minor Waves down to Intermediate (C) in March 2020. This last wave down was counted as a diagonal, and could have been leading or ending. It still could be either, but at this time there isn't a good sign of a significant down turn.  So, IF this up wave makes 90% or more, it will be, yet again, be a flat wave. Why?

The three Intermediate waves down (A), (B), (C) likely make up a Primary wave lower. This is because of their total time duration, speed of the last drop, price extent, and economic impact. This is most probably Primary wave ((A)), lower. This degree designation makes sense with "the fastest drop ..", etc. comments heard on T.V. I have not seen anyone else provide this degree designation - although I don't follow every one on the internet. I can tell you it is independently derived - even if someone else comes up with it.

As such, from what I can tell, the entire era of easy impulse wave labeling has ended. We are now going to make a series of Primary waves designed to get the Cycle wave down considerably lower. The sequence should be Primary ((A)), Primary ((B)), Primary ((C)) to Cycle A, lower. The next easier to label impulse wave may not occur until that Primary ((C)) wave lower.

And, if we are in Primary ((B)), up, the market can go almost where it will, again. This is The Fourth Wave Conundrum at Cycle Degree now, and larger, and the conundrum happens at every degree of trend.

Many people said they wish I would concentrate on the longer term. I was not willing to do that until this point in time. The reason is simple, if prices 'go over the top again' it will confirm that the drop in stocks from 1929 to 1932 was SuperCycle [II]. And it would confirm that SuperCycle [II] was a SHARP wave, and that SuperCycle [IV] will be a FLAT or compound wave.

Yes, there is still a chance that the S&P500 because of the composition of it's stocks will not 'go over the top', and that the diagonal is leading. But, those probabilities are dropping every day, and the majority of diagonals are 'ending' anyway, which lowers the odds to begin with.

So, I remain flexible, patient and calm. I do maintain that it is only proper degree labeling that can result in fewer times Elliott Wave charts need relabeling, and only proper degree labeling that can help answer "where are we in the Elliott Wave count?" with any level of confidence.

You will note a lot of analysts are trying now to pair the 2011 decline with the 2020 decline and have both be of the same degree - calling 2011 Cycle II, and 2020 Cycle IV. The problem with that scenario is they both present as FLAT waves, so there is no alternation. Oh, and it requires relabeling past waves which got us to the orthodox Elliott Wave top in 2018 just fine.

Sunday Morning

I added to this post on Sunday morning to outline a couple of ways a Primary ((B)) wave 'could' evolve in the SPX, if and only if, prices eventually at least get to the 90% level. Remember, a Primary ((B)) wave must be composed of at least three Intermediate Waves (A), (B), (C), or (W), (X), (Y). The first of these options, with the Minor B wave "running flat" would take more time

SPX & ES - Ways to Evolve Primary ((B))


Have a nice rest of the weekend. I'm interested in your comments. P.S. This is the second post this weekend, and you may wish to review the first one, also.

TraderJoe

47 comments:

  1. If the NDX made five-waves-up as an A wave diagonal, it suggests that it will yet make a B down, and then a C, up, to become a more complex wave. Keep in mind, it 'could be' an ending diagonal, but if it is a Leading Diagonal, then it is most likely an A wave, with B down to follow.

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  2. ..in the above chart, ever note how precisely (5) = (1) from the low. It is clues like this I use in the analysis; not 'hope' as referred to.

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  3. Wow! That is truly a mind blowing chart.
    It also answers a long-standing question that has perplexed me about EWT and CB liquidity driven price action. It shows you can indeed see HIGHER HIGHS in a CORRECTIVE wave at LOWER DEGREE!!
    GAME CHANGER imho.
    Most EW analysts I would wager are too myopic to even consider this possibility and it explains whey they are so often WRONG.
    What is truly magnificent about that possible chart is that it clearly shows you can follow ALL the rules and STILL credibly account for the unusual price action
    we have been witnessing of late. Nice!

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  4. My only question is why is the sub-waves of primary A not an impulse rather than a three wave pattern...

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    Replies
    1. ..compound flats, start with a flat; and a flat is 3-3-5; so the first wave down is "3", not 5.

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  5. I have been talking about a similar count and posted as such in my forum a while back that this is a wave of a much larger degree than people are thinking, sincerely, @3wavetrader.

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    Replies
    1. yes, the down moves so far are too small in both time and price.

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  6. This is good stuff. Much thanks ET. Quite uncannily I have just been reviewing back to 2009. I am in total agreement with the 2018 high. Thereafter, until I read your post, I concluded "the lows are in" at 3/23. Your post has now made me seriously question my conclusion and I have numerous questions as a result. Today I will ask just one.

    The 1929 to 1932 correction was 34 months. The correction from 2018 to March 2020 was (almost 18) months. The correction from 2007 to 2009 was (almost) 17 months. The correction to March 2009 you're labelling Primary ((4)), when did it begin? Did it begin in October 2007 (SPX 1576) or March 2000 (SPX 1553)? If it was a flat that began in March 2000 then it measures 9 years (or 108 months).

    So here's my weekend question. If your longer term labelling is correct are we then to expect SuperCycle [IV] to last at least 34 months and possibly/probably at least 9 years (or 108 months)?

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    Replies
    1. Primary ((4)) began in 2000, and was a flat. Well, considering that you have to make three cycle degrees wave lower to the SuperCycle, and considering that we haven't even made one Cycle degree wave lower, yet, in two years, the 9 year 'or longer' time frame seems correct.

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    2. Whilst a sobering piece of data it makes perfect sense from a degree perspective. Very thought provoking. Thanks.

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  7. In attempting to determine the minimum required displacement for primary B, we we measure the START of primary A, or do we measure from the highest sub-wave?

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  8. ..the second one is clearly a smaller degree 'fractal' of the first one. Fractals are expected, unless they were to conflict with alternation in their relative degrees - which these do not.

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  9. Thank you very much ET.
    I would be happy to clear.
    Are we still in Minute B of Minor B of Intermediate A?
    Thank you in advance.
    Valeriy

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    Replies
    1. See the prior post .. Minute ((b)). Or Minor C as a roughly equal alternate.. if this current wave extends. The Primary ((B)) wave up can be complex.

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  10. ..what is 'this' you are referring to?

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  11. What time relationship can we expect for this ((B)) wave and the prior ((A)) wave, which took over a year to complete? Price-wise, ((B)) is at, or nearing where its peak would be expected - with or without an over-throw to new highs - but what about time? Can a 16 month ((A)) wave be corrected in a 3 month ((B)) wave?

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    Replies
    1. I have added the best options I see for the start of the Primary((B)) wave; see Sunday's addition to the main post.

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  12. I agree with this count. I have had this as my long term count since June 2018 when I projected the decemeber 2018 bear, bull into early 2020 and 2020 bear we are in. But as uusal these b waves we are in now, always go longer than expected. But looks like nearing the end.

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  13. Thanks Joe. Since I have been following for years - I was already aware this was your count to the top and an ABC lover. I see now why you have waited to put the higher degree labels as you wanted building evidence of alternation to the 1929 move. Makes sense to me now.

    The measurement and validation of degree counts, as witnessed here over the past 3-5 years, add confidence.

    Its been a bull market over my lifetime to date so expanded flat B wave highs all resolved higher relatively quickly. Its going to be unusual to see a B wave out there for years. It will be interesting to see how it counts moving forward.

    Thanks for all your work and education

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  14. ? 4th wave conundrum at SUPER cycle degree?

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  15. And what if the move from 2009->2018 was just wave 1 of the supercycle wave III and we are now in some kind of wave 3 of III up? There is still much too much pessimism around.

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    Replies
    1. ...and "what if the moon were made of green cheese" .. such a count would not fit with degree labeling in any manner or sense, and the onus would be on you to show how it does.

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  16. I added to the main post, above, on Sunday morning to show some ways a Primary ((B)) wave could evolve, provided that the S&P500 index/ ES futures make it to the 90% retracement level, first.

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  17. With the ((a))((b)) ext. retrace already in excess of 2.24 (left chart), I lean towards your chart on the right. Thanks for both.

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  18. On the futures chart, A x .618 = C comes in around 3249, and 90% retrace around 3275.
    If C makes the 90%, why would the larger (WXY) be necessary? Only for time?
    Thanks

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    Replies
    1. .. Primary ((B)), if it occurs as the larger degree wave, should be 'larger' than just Intermediate (C) down, the smaller degree wave. A 90% wave wouldn't do that. If it goes over the top, it would.

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    2. Duh. Gotcha, thanks.

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  19. yep - a 4th wave of higher degree...with first internet boom undoubtedly the iii of 3..
    thanks joe

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  20. Do you have the numbers that go with the labels? Where does 3 of (3) end?

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    Replies
    1. In the ES futures 3 of (3) likely ends on Sept 1, 2014 @ 2,014.50. This allows wave 4 of (3) as a short sharp that alternates with 2 of (3) which is a long flat. The Dow's chart is a bit different, but I'm not going through all the nuances. You should spend some time and energy doing this and it will help build your appreciation for the wave structure.

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  21. Joe, thanks for your analysis to date. Would you expect this wave count with $NYAD at all time highs and multiple breadth thrusts? Thanks Sam

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  22. ET in response to GreyWaver regarding the necessity for a 90% retrace you state Primary ((B)) needs to go "over the top" as the larger degree wave.

    1. Does this also mean that Primary ((B)) needs to be longer in TIME than the longest time consuming Intermediate wave which would be Intermediate (B) of Primary ((A)) which took approx. 14 months?

    2. I think I understand "time and price" with respect to correct degree labelling. What I am struggling with is why the necessity for a 90% retrace if that will only represent a portion of Primary ((B)). Can you please elaborate on this point.

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  23. Fascinating Joe, you are truly gifted. Thanks!

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  24. Hi Joe, someone has your Supercycle [III] marked as 1 of Supercycle [III] and the March low as completion of 2 of Supercycle [III] and now being in 3 of [III]. I have always wondered when you go with a completed wave versus subdivided wave. Can you please help? Thanks!

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  25. hello ET

    if the "corona decline" was a diagonal it must be a leading diagonal. it is not an ending diagonal after all because it did not retrace the entire diagonal in less time then it formed. but imho it can also be counted as five normal waves down, so it does not change much to the picture...

    other then that i agree with the count but i think this ((B)) wave is gonna take a lot of time, it does not have to go straight to the 90% level. i think that your orginal count for ES can still work, this would give us a decline soon but not the crash that a lot of people expect... just finishing the B wave. then a C wave up, but these three waves up could only be the (a) of ((B))... a retest of the corona lows could still happen at that point. so yeah, could be very complex but i am expecting this (B) to go on for awhile

    joske vermeulen

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  26. This was a great read and best EWT approach, thank you.

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  27. Lol ET, you can delete that last question too - P1 C5 tops 1987, P3 C5 tops 2000 - is that right? Where did you put P2?

    If C1 tops in 1937 - can you address it being only 5 years while C5 is more like 40ish?

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  28. Not quite at 90%, but close at roughly 87%
    Close at the highs likely means ES will tag it overnight.
    I think we see overhead gap closure with at tag of 3000.00 at the very least.
    Tomorrow will be interesting.
    VIX firing off warning shots...

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    Replies
    1. please explain

      overhead gap closure is above 3300...how does 3000 enter into the mix?

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    2. It "might" prove round number resistance...

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    3. Oops! I meant 3300....sorry..

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