In an earlier blog post we discussed a minimum configuration for the end of "five waves down". (You can see that post at this LINK). We continued to count for an impulse wave, as that is what Elliott theory tells us to expect, first. With last night's overnight gap up, and today's higher high the case for an impulse wave, lower, got severely less probable. Could one still happen? Yes, but the odds are much, much, lower. Please review the chart below, and I will explain.
Taking as many factors as possible into consideration, it appears a diagonal count lower fits best for an Intermediate wave, lower. The factors are these: a) Minor 5 is shorter than Minor 3 in time and in price, b) Minor 3 is shorter than Minor 1 in time and in price, c) wave 4 is shorter in price than wave 2 and overlaps wave 1 without exceeding the end of wave 2, d) each of Minor wave 5 and 3 have divergence on the Elliott Wave Oscillator, and e) any reasonable parallel has now been broken to the upside.
So, the only factor that did not work out in a pristine manner is that wave Minor 4 is slightly longer in time than Minor 2. Well, that is typically viewed as OK in Elliott wave work. But, one of the key considerations is that Minor wave 2 is the largest upward wave on the board. Unless it were part of a triangle - a solution we tried - it would be a degree violation. And, the fact is that the wave is now part of the triangle's cousin - the diagonal. We explained in a previous post how the patterns are cousins because the three-wave sequences can fit into either - given the right circumstances.
Thus, the potential degree violation for this wave 2 is worked out. I fully admit I did not catch the exact the diagonal at the time it formed. But I was looking for upward waves to A, as the minute ((c)) waves of Minor wave 4, and they occurred. Last night, the impulse count said there should have been a downward wave. There wasn't. That results in the diagonal count.
Don't think it's a diagonal? Put yourself in the shoes of a pure bull who is sure we are going over the top again. Nothing would better fit that bill than to have ended a Intermediate (C) wave down as a diagonal.
But, you know diagonals, They could be ending or leading. In a Leading Diagonal wave 5 can not fail. It didn't in this case. That makes the odds about 50:50 from here - purely on the basis of a wave count - as to whether we go over the high again or not.
For now, though, we need to see how this retrace wave progresses. It could have surprises. If there become only three waves up, it could easily go under the lows again. Remember, this whole FED Intervention process with the threat of QE Unlimited is specifically to do their best to fool the wave counters.
So, get some sleep and have a good night.
TraderJoe
I was looking at some charts over the weekend and I think there may be an argument that the current bear is part of the same pattern from the last drop in 2019
ReplyDeleteJoe, do you think your diagonal down is the extended wave of the upcoming 5 down? if not, the next wave at 1.618 targets 1000 spx. And it cant be wave 1 of a diagonal down - its not 3 waves. So either 1) it was a c wave down, 2) its not the extended wave with 2 more lows below 1000 spx , or 3) it is the extended wave with 2 more lows but if we go any higher that count gets murky trying to keep wave 4 below wave 1...cant be diagonal. Nit trying to give you hard time - just thinking this through and measuring - seems that the count you are presenting is low probability unless you expect sub 1000 spx... do you
ReplyDelete?
The problem with questions like this one is that they leave out many possibilities. What if the diagonal down is (A), and there is a (B) wave, up to some level, and a near-equal (C) leg down at some point to start a large primary degree triangle?
DeleteI would much rather have readers at this level 'demonstrate' they can accurately count waves - following degree considerations - than ponder so far ahead.
I'm not trying to be testy. But I see readers like BBRider trying, and doing reasonably well. But, we see little work from you.
i hope everyone understands what you mean by a higher primary degree wave 4 triangle thats a very importnat comment thanks joe
Delete@marc; no. Readers should not take that as an important comment (the higher degree primary triangle). You, personally, should just take it as a possibility you failed to foresee or include in your note. The larger point is 'where' are your wave counts? You can't learn to see what can be ahead unless you practice and are willing to see where one count differs from another.
DeleteUnderstand completely thanks
ReplyDeleteI find your comment about demonstrating that they can accurately count waves interesting in light of the fact that we've just seen a move to the Mar 22 low go from being 3 waves (and starting a supposed flat) to becoming 5 waves. 3 into 5. The apparent "b" wave of the flat became the 5th wave (corrective b wave into impulsive 5th). This coming as a result of subsequent price action, suggesting after the fact determination. To me, this simply points out the subjective nature of EW. No reflection on the practitioner, but rather EW itself. If someone of your extensive training requires subsequent price action to tell 5 from 3, imagine how the rest of us feel! lol Just one person's observation.
ReplyDelete@Grey .. I have been counting waves for so many years, and seen so many types of waves that I 'do' have much sympathy for the beginners. Yes, one simply has to admit when one wave count doesn't look probable any more, and move on to the one that does look more probable. But I must say this. The down from the high was one of the most challenging I have come across. It's like "The New York Times" of crossword puzzles, compared to the local newspaper. So - and I have mentioned this so often - one goes lightly until one gets confirmation. I offered a clear confirmation point today. It never occurred. Keep it simple.
DeleteTend to agree with this comment. Despite best efforts attempting to quantify and objectify Elliott Wave analysis, fact is, its remains a highly subjective and probable discipline; its a theory, not a principle. A fully quantified and objective price prediction methodology would defy all free-will. The market is an expression of human behavior, and at times can be predictable, but is overall irrational, probable and random. It is therefore best to take into consideration all viable viewpoints and consider all Elliott Wave counts under a given ruleset...
DeleteI would hazard a guess to say the next leg down is underway...
https://12345abcdewxy.wordpress.com/2020/04/06/2020-apr-06/
I believe you did, and kudos if it helped you. The problem is that without a reliable down count from you, it's just another piece of 'data' and not fit into the complete picture.
ReplyDeleteThis chart doesn't look like the S&P500 chart for the early days of March. A piece or some days are missing, that clerly show a 1-2-wave-movement.
ReplyDeleteCan you check and explain?
he's using a futures chart (ES) - are you looking at sp500 futures?
Delete..sorry .. a bad data load the first time; corrected chart posted with same result.
DeleteMany thanks, now I got it ;)
DeleteAn a = c move would bring us smack into horizontal resistance.
ReplyDeletehttps://imgur.com/VwIEF3s
If the SP reaches that resistance then the whole leg down should be viewed as an A wave, and this rally a B, with a C to follow to retest and likely break the lows. It seems I spend all my trading life of late in B waves. This one might be another monster, thanks to the FED. Last one of those was the rally of the Christmas 2018 lows to the February 2020 highs. What a monster that was. This one might be even bigger.
DeleteAnd SP fails around here - likely - then we're likely putting finishing touches to c of iv, with v still to come to complete the first down-leg.
DeleteVisually looks like a five over the last 2 days on ES but 3 is the shortest wave and EWO look like a W.
ReplyDeleteI'm trying to count it - not an expert in any way, but if we fail to go higher - would this be possible? Bearish divergence on the hourly RSI makes me think it's an option. Trying to study Neely daily, never quite certain if I have the labels correct. Thanks for any input from anyone. https://invst.ly/qdh02
ReplyDelete..possible!
DeleteES five waves down off the high.
ReplyDeleteHere's the local five-waves down. Interesting wave ((2)) was >62%, and wave ((3)) wave < 1.62% x ((1)).
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdhdg
TJ
link won't open on safari or firefox ET
Deleteignore, safari finally opened the link.
DeleteThe five waves down following a double top in that chart looks like an a-b-c to me, rather than five down being the start of an impulse. Or are you leaning toward five down being the start of something more bearish?
DeleteHigh this morning could also be 1 of a contracting ending diagonal.
ReplyDeleteET, there is a 1.5ish rule break on gold, but it looks like your idea of choppiness in gold was spot on. I think we are in the beginning of a 4 of a Contracting Ending Diagonal.
ES (1-min). Short term, Five waves up from the low in a channel; then a channel break.
ReplyDeletehttps://invst.ly/qdi68
TJ
..watching for overlap on ((a))..
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdir7
TJ
So is it likely that this small five up is an a of b of four of whatever up wave this is?
DeleteCan't open in Google chrom. IE or Edge :-(
Deleteif you refresh a time or two it shows up - the website server is slow
DeleteSo, now there is clear overlap on ((a)).
ReplyDeletehttps://invst.ly/qdjfi
TJ
I have us in a small fourth wave of iii of C. So maybe a pop to 2800 cash to complete wave iii, then a larger sideways churn in iv, before we complete v of C near 2900.
ReplyDeleteNow there is a potential diagonal.
ReplyDeletehttps://invst.ly/qdjp4
TJ
..could be part of a triangle fourth wave or some similar construction.
Delete..now breech of upper diagonal trend line.
DeleteHere's what it looks like so far .. there are two sets of waves lower with the third wave = first wave.
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdk1g
Market would have to add an additional non-overlapping leg lower to convert the starting diagonal into an impulse, lower.
TJ
..there is the next lower low, so this entire move, starting with a Leading Contracting Diagonal may be counted impulsively.
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdk49
TJ
Daily GC getting a reaction off of upper bb, overbought, with negative divergences on AO and macd: https://invst.ly/qdka4
ReplyDeleteNow a larger impulse downward, still, and a new lower low. Parallel zigzag or 'base' channel can be drawn on the five minute chart. (First impulse just part of a larger impulse).
ReplyDeletehttps://invst.ly/qdkjr
TJ
see note on chart .. it means the 'upward pull' is relatively strong.
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdknh
TJ
..as far as I can tell, this diagonal is possible. Look familiar?
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdl31
TJ
now up over wave ((2))
Deletequite the day!
Deletehttps://invst.ly/qdl82
TJ
Very much so!
DeleteHello sir I am big fan of your work had last seen your video on youtube in 2017 and next I found you here can you please update your count on gold thank you.
ReplyDelete