Sunday, October 13, 2024

Simple .. but Not Easy

Some traders say trading is "easy" but not simple. It's easy because all you do is press a buy or sell button. But the complexity in making a profit is knowing "when" and at "what price" to buy or sell. Hopefully, the Elliott Wave Principle helps one make those decisions. I'm showing some long-term charts today to show you that there is currently nothing wrong with the Elliott Wave, at least as I'm counting it. First, the yearly chart of the Dow.

DJIA Cash - Yearly - Close Only

The wave is nicely in a parallel, with the "running second wave" the omen of the great upward strength that followed. (Not recognizing this by-the-way may be the single largest mistake Elliott counters have made). The RSI diverges on this Vth wave, and as long as wave III is greater than wave I, then "by the rules" wave V can be "any length". Any top will likely be SuperCycle [III]. Now on to the Monthly.

DJIA Cash - Monthly Close - In a Channel

Again, nothing too wrong here. The wave is nicely in a channel, and it has not left the channel to the downside yet. Primary  "might be" a triangle, but it might also just be a Flat. The Flat is shown. IFF wave  was a triangle then wave  "might be" over already. But, again, with higher prices there is just nothing to make that conclusive and there are other options. So, as long as prices are higher, we continue to explore other options. In this wave since Primary ④ we note there is not currently a confirmed triangle or diagonal. And we note that since wave  is longer than wave , then wave  "by-the-rules" can be any length. You'll note the RSI divergence has busted above.

So, we began the counting of Primary  looking potentially for a contracting ending diagonal wave. In that wave, wave Intermediate (3) simply must be shorter than wave Intermediate (1). So far, it is, so we don't want to get off track. That remains the current count - especially in the Dow. 

Now, we know that the NDX has 'exceeded' its length of Intermediate (1). What if the ES/SPX does that too? Students of Elliott Wave likely know that the options are few - making life somewhat simpler than guessing at random: here are two of them.

ES Futures - Monthly Continuous Close - Two Patterns

IFF wave Intermediate (3) becomes longer than Intermediate (1), then one case can be made for the non-overlapping impulse upward. In that case, wave (3) might tend towards 1.27 or 1.62 x wave (1). It has not done so yet. There is no requirement that wave Primary  contain a diagonal, but given the extent of the rise it certainly is likely. So, what I am saying is this wave could end with an impulse. In this case, maybe wave (4) would be a triangle or wave (5) would be a diagonal - still within the larger impulse on the left. All of that is completely possible.

But the other - more ugly - case is simply for the expanding diagonal.  This case would become more likely the more overheated sentiment and upward price targets get as we head into the election. And it is starting to get there already. It would still be a way to end Cycle V with a diagonal! Note that the Dow is showing some signs of an expanding diagonal already, but at a lower degree. And also note that daily Bollinger Bands are not too far overhead. Further, either of these two patterns would explain why Intermediate (3) is now longer-in-time than Intermediate (1).

The thing is that patience is needed. And a stopping point (or terminal) of this upward wave and reversal is needed for any decision-making at all. So, we are keen on the lookout for the latter and urging with all intensity the former. Let's not lose sight of the basic measurements, the parallels, the basic patterns and the rules.

Have an excellent rest of the weekend,

TraderJoe

25 comments:

  1. thanks. what are restrictions on "subwaves" of wave 5's that are unlimited. they MUST exist OR you have just allowed for unrestricted thrid waves, as the top chart above infers [II] is now unrestricted. in top chart by definition you have [II] being any length by definition - both its 5th wave and a subwave of its 5th wave are unrestricted.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. That is a question that has two components: a) a between wave component, and b) a within wave component.

      So, 'between' waves, degree labels apply. So, no Intermediate sub-wave of Primary ⑤ can be log-larger than the largest primary wave of III. And that is the case, the current Intermediate sub-waves of Primary ⑤ of V, i.e. (1), (3) are log-smaller than the prior Primary ③ wave, the largest higher degree wave in the same direction.

      Now, within the wave, the 'particular' pattern limitations apply e.g. the lengths required for a contracting or expanding diagonal, the 78% lengths of triangle legs, or of a typical impulse, etc.

      Best I can do at this time.
      TJ

      Delete
    2. Thanks. Now Circle 4 you pointed out was smaller than c wave of 2000 to 2009 correction. But subwave of circle 5 is larger than the b wave of that correction. Now we know the subwave 1 of circle 5 is bigger than circle 1, and all subwaves of circle 3 are less than circle 1, so we have that b wave in 2004 to 2007 being exceeded not by a wave of same degree, but of lower degree. Just another way to think about degrees here. If 2020 was 1, covid was 2, then that wave is now smaller than 1 and 1 is bigger than B wave and it's same degree. Time will tell.

      Delete
    3. @marc .. although it's a little unclear what you are doing, if you're comparing any current waves to 2004 - 2007, it is likely what I call "counting-wave-degrees-backwards-in-time". This is to be avoided at all costs. You only count wave degrees forward in time. The reason is this: as the FED and the Gov't dump money and debt onto the system, one expects to create new larger waves "going forward" not backward. For proof of this, look at this chart of the SPX/GOLD.

      https://www.tradingview.com/x/YXH0iHcA/

      In terms of "hard money" stocks are nowhere near their all-time highs. They are only back 38% from the 2000 high. This means - as best as I can tell - the market's new highs are all from debt expansion/money creation, not real economic expansion (new production). Therefore, one has to "count forward" and not backwards into the previous cycles.

      In counting forward, you compare "the current up wave, to the previous wave of one higher degree in the same direction- or the longest wave in that degree - only". And when comparing downward, you compare "the current down wave to the previous wave of one higher degree in the same direction- or the longest wave in that degree - only".

      TJ

      Delete
  2. This is all SP500 charts.

    Since 2009, this makes the most sense to me.

    https://imgur.com/APB41UX

    because the first bars to leave the channel would in my mind, be the 2.

    https://imgur.com/AxglB6l

    now if 4 is over, I have this.

    https://imgur.com/ta5DfB5

    and 5 could be an ending diagonal

    https://imgur.com/Geq0cM2

    if 4 is not over, then a running triangle I would think is a high probability to alternate in form with the covid 2. It would also make it channel better back to 09.

    https://imgur.com/sJGdCPq

    THX and all input welcome.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. As I said previously, the supposed 5-to-3 divergence has been lost!

      https://www.tradingview.com/x/LNUmEINu/

      TJ

      Delete
    2. As I said previously, you now have 1 longer in time than 3, and the supposed 5 longer in time than 3. This is not the usual progression of waves.

      Delete
    3. Please see this link, about a quarter of the way down, where they cite that wave 4 "often" breaks the original 1-3, 2-4 parallel.

      https://www.elwave.com/support/faq/principle/principle3.html

      You can be mis-identifying your 2.

      TJ

      https://www.elwave.com/support/faq/principle/principle3.html

      Delete
    4. Is the triangle 'possible'? Sure, but there is no sign of the C down leg yet. Again, a triangle can not be 'called' until all five legs are in the market. TJ.

      Delete
    5. Further, by degree labeling "B" in a triangle 'should not be' longer in time than the prior larger degree (3) - which it already is in time. TJ.

      Delete
  3. Thanks for the response. In your Friday post you also have 3 running half the bars of 1 in the (3)/(C) wave. Just don't like how in your monthly, I cant even see the 4 in (1), and (3) has a major correction right at the 50% Marker.

    Probably should expect a shit show monthly wave as this is a fifth wave on the yearly. As you stated, nothing for reversals or broken parallels yet. Glad its fall and the hunting and fishing is at hand.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Precisely! If you "can't see the 4 in (1), that 'probably' means that (1) is a three- wave sequence. That's why I visited contracting diagonal first, and if (3) gets longer, then expanding diagonal next. Because (1) in 'either' a contracting or an expanding diagonal can be a three-wave sequence! Good work. TJ.

      Delete
  4. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Sorry, but that's not a count acceptable under the "rules". You have iv overlapping i, and a host of other problems. For an expanding pattern, iii needs to be greater than i, etc. etc. You are just drawing trend lines in a 'cartoon' fashion, and sticking numbers where you want them. Please do not post charts that don't follow the EW rules, since that's what this blog is about. TJ

      Delete
  5. I thought contracting ED rules required 3 to be shorter than 1, and 5:to be shorter than 3. If 3 is longer than 1 a contracting ED is therefore negated. If 3 is not, 5:is then limited nonetheless to remaining shorter than 3

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. To what are you referring? Who's count? Which comment? TJ

      Delete
    2. I may have misread the comment suggesting no limit to the fifth wave as applying to a potential DJIA contracting ED

      Delete
  6. Still a nice pararell on DJIA imo. ((c)) of Y need to turn here though if correct...

    https://invst.ly/16th3i

    In a double zz b of Y doesn´t "need" to overlap W..?

    As mentioned here before this count also erases the 2023 time degree violation from counting a motive wave from oct 22 bottom.






    ReplyDelete
  7. SPY 5-min: yeaaa .. right.

    https://www.tradingview.com/x/WQrZ8Jbj/

    TJ

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. above is a triangle then impulse could have just ended

      Delete
    2. Or it is this - which works well from the measurements. I can't find large enough overlaps for the triangle (i.e. 62 - 78%).

      https://www.tradingview.com/x/M3aaeToL/

      TJ

      Delete
    3. yes same thing i had triangel starting ending 3 small bars to right

      Delete
  8. Seems like we have completed the 3rd wave of the move propelled by feds...may reach 5th of wed or sometime this week. This may correlate with nvda making new high..

    ReplyDelete
  9. A new post is started for the next day.
    TJ

    ReplyDelete