This is the very essence of the Fourth Wave Conundrum. With just a small paragraph above, we definitively outline why the Elliott analyst simply can not know the precise wave count at every point in time - as much as some publications and web-sites say they do. We are currently in such a situation.
From the standpoint of The Eight Fold Path Methodology, there are now 123 candles on the weekly chart for the "wave of interest". This is now well within the range of the recommended 120 - 160 candles. And, even within this methodology, there are two good and clear options for upward price progress. The first is the Smaller Triangle scenario.
S&P500 Cash - Weekly - Smaller Triangle |
Price can still be seen to be trading in the main channel, after having aggressively attacked the lower trend channel boundary. Minor 4 would be completed, and we would have finished minute ((i)), up, and are working on a flat wave for minute ((ii)). Nothing says minute ((ii)) downward is definitely completed yet. Only a new daily higher high over wave ((b)) would do that. This scenario tends to agree with the Elliott Wave Oscillator (EWO), which is a key tool in The Eight Fold Path Method.
Yet, a different outcome - with maybe only slightly lower probability - is shown on the next chart.
S&P500 Cash - Weekly - The Larger Triangle Scenario |
Again, nothing says the minute ((e)) wave lower is completed yet, so we could not say that Minor 4 would be over yet. In fact, for this scenario, it would be best if minute ((e)) extended a bit lower in price again. But this count does not agree as well with the Elliott Wave Oscillator, nor has wave ((e)) come back down to fully test the lower channel line again. And, with the wider triangle now, it seems less likely to get an exit from the triangle near its apex for many, many weeks yet. Those are the factors that result in this second count having the somewhat lower probability. Still, it is plausible.
But, there is one common "bottom line" factor to both price charts: prices should not trade below wave minute ((c)) for the triangles to remain "healthy". Breaking the ((c)) wave low is a "make or break" scenario for the triangle counts. Just like breaking minute wave ((b)) higher means price is likely breaking out of the triangle to the upside, then breaking minute wave ((c)), lower, means a downside break of the pattern would be most likely.
We should note that making a new all-time high in the S&P500 or the Dow are not foregone conclusions or preordained. There are possibilities that allow failures or lower lows. But, there is insufficient, and even contradictory evidence, for the lower case at this time.
Therefore, we remain patient, calm and flexible as we approach the Nation's Birthday celebration. Have a great weekend.
TraderJoe
Joe, the only realistic SPX bullish count that I can see is one that you haven't mentioned. That would label the rally from 5/3 to 6/13 as wave i of an EDT. Until the market proves otherwise, though. I'm still favoring the bearish count that the 6/13 high ended a flat correction that began at the 2/9 low.
ReplyDeleteThere are rule violations in a diagonal (leading or ending) from 5/3 to 6/13. The SPX would likely have a flat wave, and the DOW would definitely have wave (iii) longer than wave (i). I have written to a major Elliott Wave service that they should stop posting these counts, as they violate their own rules. Others should too.
DeleteYou misunderstood my post. I'm not saying the 5/3 to 6/13 rally is an EDT. I'm saying it can be counted as a zig-zag, which would be wave i of an EDT. I obviously don't favor that count, though, because I see the 5/3 to 6/13 rally as a 3:3:5 (5/14:5/29:6/13), but if really forced, it could be called a 5:3:5 (5/22:5/29:6/13)
Delete"I'm still favoring the bearish count that the 6/13 high ended a flat correction that began at the 2/9 low." That means the up wave had to be a C wave - just as EWI has it labeled - or possibly the Y wave of W-X-Y. The former is out the window, as far as I can tell.
DeleteWe both know that 4/2 to 6/13 does not meet the requirements for an EDT. I'm counting 2/9 to 6/13 as W-X-Y.
DeleteThanks for the great analysis Joe. Superb as always sir
ReplyDeleteThanks for the update, and especially for the reminder of patience, it’s easy to get ”sucked in” by ”fear of missing out”.
ReplyDeleteAnother bearish alternate (cash index) might be a flat count from 2/9 low and we’re currently in a C wave up BUT as an expanded ending diagonal as follows: 1: 2/4-18/4, 2: 18/4-3/5, 3: 3/5-13/6. So the current 4th wave has to go below ~2670 to become deeper than wave 2, I also believe all waves are zigzags and 3 is longer than 1.
This count is also plausible on dow cash?
/ Erik
Hi Erik . That count would have a very, very low probability at this point, not only because wave four isn't long enough - as you cite - but also because (as I spent an entire blog post explaining) usually the wave (i) of any ending diagonal is made over the wave 3 high, to show it's character as a true Motive Wave. If you have questions about this, you can refer to diagram 1-19 on Page 39 of The Elliott Wave Principle by Frost & Prechter, where an Ending Expanding Diagonal is detailed.
DeleteJoe, the first question that has to be asked is this: Can an expanding diagonal triangle occur as the C wave of a flat? If the answer is yes, then it would be normal to expect that the only part of the expanding EDT that would be equal to (or surpass) the price level of the A wave would be wave (v) of the EDT.
DeleteEven if the answer is yes, the current rally from 4/2 still doesn't qualify as an expaning EDT because all waves have to be zigzags (5:3:5), however the initial wave up from 4/2 to 4/18 subdivided as a flat 3:3:5 (4/5:4/6:4/18). The 5/3 to 6/13 was also a 3:3:5 (5/14:5/29:6/13)
Thanks Joe for the longer term charts and analysis. Really appreciate those. Have a very happy Independence Day too!
ReplyDeleterose